Running Technique - The Footstrike

[Maria Imas]

Another interesting article on this high quality blog:

http://scienceofsport.blogspot.com/2008/04/running-technique-footstrike.html

All the more interesting in light of Sasha's experiment with Crocs. From my own observations, I definitely land on the forefoot/midfoot when running sprints, further back but still somewhat midfoot when running up to 1500m, but in anything longer I land on the heel first. This tends to support authors' observations as well. Racing flats definitely help in shifting the weight forward, or so it feels. I find it harder to land on the midfoot in regular trainers (the best ones are Mizuno Riders, which allow me midfoot landing on tempos).

[Tom]

Interesting article Maria. My observations are similar to yours and as far as foot landing patterns during faster running and sprints vs. slow/easy runs. I wholeheartedly agree also that flats tend to make you shift weight forward and I think typically run with better form.

I've been gradually running more and more miles each week using my flats for shorter/faster workouts and lighter shoes on easy runs. I noticed a while back that my PF problems seemed to do better after I ran in flats which was opposite to what I would have predicted. Lately as I'm running about 1/3-1/2 my miles in ligher shoes the PF is all but gone and my ankles/calves seem more durable and less injury prone. Eventually I would like to do most all my running using either flats or a lighter shoe like the Asic DSTrainer2.

The only problem I've had is with blisters running with the light flats, but I figure that's just a matter of running in them more and getting a bit of calous built up on the bottoms of the feet. My wife Kim will attest that I have really girly-man baby-bottom type feet.

Personally I really like the Adidas Adizero flats (between 5-6 oz. I think) for the shorter/faster workouts and the Asic DSTrainer2s (9 oz I think) for the longer runs. I'm hoping to gradually retire my long-time use Asics Gel 2x00 and Landreths (10-12 oz) over the next couple months.

I haven't tried running in Crocs just yet

[adam]

Tom,

I've noticed the same thing in the Adizero rc flats (the hot spots/blister area). I've also tried using the adizero cs flats/lite trainers (about 8 oz, so just a little heavier, but the same upper as the rc) and felt the form improvements without the hot spots. I've been using those for 13-15 mile runs just fine.

[Tom]

Adam thanks for the tip. I've thought of trying the heavier CS model for comparison.

Do you feel like they would do well for an entire marathon?

[adam]

very much so. the farthest i've gone in them is 15 miles, and I know there's a big difference between 15 and 26, but at the end of that run I noticed no problems (no hot spots, rubbing) and that they were still giving back (I actually felt stronger in them the farther I went, but that is probably more conditioning based than the shoes). I felt like they could have held up another 10 miles. they also break in very easily.

[Maria Imas]

I had great results with Saucony Fastwitch Endurance (for races up to 15K), and DS Trainer (for half and full marathon). Saucony's are one of the very few racing flats that come in women's sizes, but I heard good feedback from men as well.

[Sasha Pachev]

My opinion. Good form is a consequence of being fit - having strong legs, strong nervous system, proper weight, good body structure, etc. They say the guy can only run 9:00 pace because he has  bad form. Nonsense. He has bad form because he is not fit to run with good one. He is overstriding and breaking hard with his heel. Why? Because it would wear him out to pull his foot back under his body right before it hits the ground if he did it with every step. His muscles and his nervous system would tire out quickly if he tried. Excess weight in the belly, and bad spine might make the task difficult if not impossible as well.

His turnover is only 160. Why? Because he is unable to generate a sustained nervous impulse to his muscles to get his foot off the ground quickly enough to turn over at 180. The task might be complicated again with an excess weight in combination with atrophied muscles.

The good news is that 80% of those issues are solved by consistent mileage, good sleep, and proper diet. I am still working on the other 20%.

[Adam R Wende]

Bringing up an old discussion. Any opinions on these flats appreciated...
I know this started back in April but I had a question about the Adizero CS. Do people still recommend them? I really liked the Adistar Competition but I can not find them anywhere in my size... (Size 11). I tried the Asics DS-Racer this week as I've trained in the DS-Trainer a lot and either attempting to jump into them to quickly or something else did not agree with my legs. Any suggestions/opinions appreciated. Thx Adam RW

[jtshad]

I like the Sacouny Tangents and I know that several othres on the Blog run in these as well.  A bit narrower and you need to size up 1/2 a size, but a good light weight trainer that is light enough for a racing shoe as well.

I am going to give the Asics Banditos a try if I ever get them in from my race win earlier this month (the last person who won a shoe from this RD took about 7 months to get them).

[Adam R Wende]

My problem is wanting to try on the shoe before buying it. I've had a hard time finding either of those to "test"... I did however find the last pair of size 11 Adistar Competition, they are being held for me for pick-up on Sat.

[jeff]

Sasha,
I agree to a point.  My turnover is a slow 165 at recovery pace (9:15), and about 170-174 at race/tempo pace (7:30-8:00).  I run a reasonable number of miles a week, do interval and tempo workouts and have added significant hills to the mix.  I can run at a faster turnover but it feels very strange.  I believe I have the conditioning and muscle strength to deal with faster turnover but no matter how much I try it seems less efficient.  I am an old guy ,51 and one of those 190 pound types that cannot seem to drop weight.  I can only manage a 6:30 mile as my top speed.  It is not lack of endurance I don't think but I really cannot explain why I can't go any faster.  Excuses include a complete achilles tear in 2000 and slow twitch muscles.  On the other side I ran 2:03/4:30 800/1600 in high school so a little fast twitch must be present.  Just like you I cannot for the life of me understand why I cannot go faster at least for a 400/800 distance.  My best 800 is little faster than my 1600 pace.  Go figure.

[Paul Petersen]

I'm pretty sure Wasatch Running Center still carries the Tangents. I've bought two different pairs there in the past.

[Adam R Wende]

Paul, They are who had the Adistar Comps so I'll try the tangents when I'm picking up the other. I've been trying to stay 100% SRC but it has been hard not being able to drive down there...

[Kory Wheatley]

Adam RW - I would try the Asics Banditos I wore these in the Salt Lake Marathon.  The only thing I didn't like about them is the added post which the Ohana Racers (that I loved and now discontinued) didn't have.

[Kory Wheatley]

Has anyone tried the Avia Bolt shoes.  The Avia Lites are really good lightweight trainer shoes.  I have 4 pairs of them with 600 miles.