Ryan Hall

[Dale]

I figured Sammy Wanjiru had the advantage because he's been training in Japan for so long, which has both hot and humid conditions.  Beijing probably felt downright balmy compared to Japan in the summer months....

[Jon Allen]

So a 4-foot tall, dark skinned pygmy should be the fastest of all?  What about if he raced against a 3-foot tall, fair skinned pygmy?  We need to thoroughly test this!

Or maybe Wanjiru just ran an awesome race that was a much faster pace than the American's and almost everyone else had expected, so they didn't try to stick with the lead pack.  Some days you just fire on all 6 cylinders...

[Jose Jimenez]

Anyone running that fast for that long under those conditions is a freak of nature no matter what color he is.  I stand in awe of Sammy W's performance.

[Neil Price]

Yeah, wow. How do you come up with this stuff?

Don't argue with science.

[Neil Price]

So a 4-foot tall, dark skinned pygmy should be the fastest of all?  What about if he raced against a 3-foot tall, fair skinned pygmy?  We need to thoroughly test this!

You just blew my mind.

[adam]

Skin tone can't train. Height can't train. People train.

Rothlin beat both Ritz and Hall, is slower than Hall by more than a minute, and was the only representative of Switzerland in the marathon.  He was 35s out of bronze, and 11s off of Lel who has run more than 2 minutes faster than him. He's ~5' 9". I'm pretty sure he's lite skinned- he's Swiss man! In 2000 he ran 2:20 for the olympic marathon. In 2004 he dropped out. Both were in less than ideal conditions. 2008 he runs 2:10 hot. Somebody learned to train for the conditions (or unfortunately learned where to pick up some not so legal aide).

Ryan Hall didn't have a great day. Period. And he knew it was coming from the first mile when he couldn't take it out. If you are running in an elite race against people you've raced against before, and you know they aren't dumb, and you aren't in that top 10 lead pack where you know should be because your skills are similar- its over for your chances of winning. Hall should have been up there with the guys he's raced against before, doing his thing. But he couldn't (or wouldn't, if you accept his race was planned). I think that if in the first 10k we had seen him mixing it up in that lead group he would have found his rythmn and placed at least 5 spots higher. He was never on the offensive this race (due to heat, due to loss of rythmn, due to being off pace, whatever you want) and you can't expect a person like Ryan Hall to race well off of a defensive race plan.





 

[Maria Imas]

Ryan Hall ran as well as he could on the day. If he tried to follow the leaders he would blow up and drop back badly, like Martinez and Ramaala did. He simply wasn't ready for 2:06-2:07 in those conditions. It also could be that he did not fully recover from London (only 4 months prior). We have to remember how exceptional this marathon was. If the conditions were cooler, we very well could have witnessed a world record. Wanjiru wasn't exhausted when he finished, he ran at least couple of victory laps and did not look distressed. It's not unreasonable to assume that he could have run in 2:04 or under range if it was cooler. He probably could have run under 2:06 in this race if he had to. I don't know what the NBC commentators were saying, but the BBC guys were all in shock and kept repeating themselves that this is not the way to run a marathon, that they all going to die, etc., etc. They couldn't get over the insane pace, and even tried to stop themselves from repeating this every minute, but they didn't know what else to think, or say. They also said "how could Lel, so experienced, allow the young Wanjiru to set such a pace??!!".

Victor Rothlin did the best from the main group, by far, and I wished that Hall and Ritz latched on and stayed with him, but they could not. Hall and Ritz did very well under the circumstances, but medals were just not in the cards the way the race went.

[Paul Petersen]

I think we'll see 2:03 or faster in the next year or two. The more I think about it, the more amazing this race seems. But perhaps not so amazing. Perhaps it is the new standard.

[Sasha Pachev]

http://results.beijing2008.cn/WRM/ENG/BIO/Athlete/3/209813.shtml

Rothlin is 5-8 and has dark hair.

http://results.beijing2008.cn/WRM/ENG/BIO/Athlete/6/241346.shtml

Wanjiru is 5-4. Pretty close to the 4 footed pygmy Jon was talking about.

 

[Jeff Linger]

Ryan Hall ran as well as he could on the day. If he tried to follow the leaders he would blow up and drop back badly, like Martinez and Ramaala did. He simply wasn't ready for 2:06-2:07 in those conditions. It also could be that he did not fully recover from London (only 4 months prior). . .    

 I don't know what the NBC commentators were saying, but the BBC guys were all in shock and kept repeating themselves that this is not the way to run a marathon, that they all going to die, etc., etc. They couldn't get over the insane pace, and even tried to stop themselves from repeating this every minute, but they didn't know what else to think, or say.

The NBC announcers commented on both of these matters. In Hall's first mile they said that his game plan was to run 2:09 pace. When taking past olympic marathons into account, this pace should place him in the medal hunt and that they felt it was an achievable pace given conditions. They also noted that they felt the pace was too fast, that Hall would catch back up to the lead pack as the lead pack began to drop. Of course, as the race continued on they also noted the insanity of the pace, but that they were beginning to think that at least a few looked like they'd be able to hold it.

[adam]

Sasha...IAAF has him at 1.74m but I still did my math wrong with that. Sorry. But, weren't we talking about skin tone, not hair color? Or are you grouping those together now?

And I really don't think we can say Ryan Hall would have blown up if he had gone out with the leaders. He is a leader. If he was unprepared for the heat (which I think he was), then yes he probably would have blown up. But I still believe that his blow up would have been less dramatic than the others. For a person who has run under 1hr for a half, split a 1:02+ second half on a hilly marathon course, the second half on this race should not have been as slow as it was given his 1:04:30 first half. He was well within himself but could not pick up the pace.

[Sasha Pachev]

Some food for thought. Sell, Hall, Rothlin and Ritz paced themselves reasonably.

Sell and Hall have identical height and weight, and both have light hair color. Both finished 6 minutes off their PRs.  Rothlin and Ritz are very similar in height, weight, and hair color, and both are Caucasian. Rothlin was 3 minutes off his PR, Ritz was less than a minute, but his PR was in the Trials - he's never run a nice flat record conditions marathon. Projecting it to London course, this would give him 2:08, so it would be fair to say he was 3 minutes of his true PR as well.

"All" that Hall had to do to get a medal was close in 1:05:30 after opening in "only" 1:04:29. He obviously tried at least that, and he could not do it. His 5 K from 35 to 40 was 16:57. Consider that in the context of what he said about his last mile in London - "I never thought I would have to work so hard to run a 5:10". Sell was down to 17:59(!). Ritz was 16:27, while Rothlin ran 15:57.

Why couldn't he? Not because he had not trained for the heat. He says in his blog he's been doing a lot of heat training. There is a reason tall blond guys historically have preferred to live in a colder climate :-)

There is even a song I heard while growing up about that situation - in this case a Russian being wasted by an African runner on a hot day:


The key event of the program is the marathon, and the temperature is 30 degrees (C, that would be 86 F). But he is used to the heat, so he is showing his class. I want to see him race in negative 30, and now, good luck catching him, all one can do is just swear.


The funny thing is that the name of that African runner in the song is Sam Brook, and it was Sam in this case as well, Sammy Wanjiru that is.

[Tyler]

Perhaps it is the new standard.

I think this is the truth.

Wanjiru's 2:06 is incredible, it completely blows my mind. He definitely raised the bar for marathoning with that race. If I were an Olympic marathoner looking forward to 2012, I'd be pretty nervous knowing that there's a guy who can run 2:06 in tough conditions and other guys that can give chase, like Gharib showed. I'm with Paul in thinking that there are more revolutionary runs to come in the near future.

Looking back, it seems like Geb more or less started the change in marathoning standards when he talked about 2:03 being possible. Back in the '90s he changed 5k and 10k standards by single-handedly lowering the world records by huge margins, and it looked like he was going to do it by himself again in the marathon. Especially with his two sub-2:05 races. But then Wanjiru quietly popped up with phenomenal races like his HM world record and this Olympic marathon. Like he's saying "This isn't the Haile show, people. I'm in it, too" It's exciting. The two of them should do amazing things in the next few years. I'm sure that others will follow.

It seems that with Hall's 2:06 in London that he's got the potential to follow these guys up the speed ladder, but he's got a long way to go. I'm not counting him out for future Olympic medals, but I feel like Wanjiru's run raised the bar for the next Olympics. Hall will have to be that much better to be in medal contention.

[Jeff Linger]

It seems that with Hall's 2:06 in London that he's got the potential to follow these guys up the speed ladder, but he's got a long way to go. I'm not counting him out for future Olympic medals, but I feel like Wanjiru's run raised the bar for the next Olympics. Hall will have to be that much better to be in medal contention.

The good news is that Hall is a Marathon Rookie with potentially a huge ceiling above him.

[Jon Allen]

And so is Wanjiru... hopefully we see many marathon world records from all the runners in years to come.