Hello!

[Martin]

Hey there,

I´m new here, just wanted to say a quick hello! I´m Martin from Germany, please consider that this isn´t my mother tongue. But I will do my best!

Also I´m very happy about any training advice! I ran my PB a few years ago (37:24 10k, 1:23 Hm, 3:17 M; before my wife gave birth to our great sons). Now I´m 36 and it will the last try to run "seriously" before I´m getting to old.  With my spare talent it is my big goal to run sub3 in a marathon in 2019. I believe that my marathon time is disatrous compared with my PB at shorter races. That´s why I want to run a lot of miles to give my cheetah legs (100m in 11,2s) enough time to build endurance. At the moment I´m trying to consistently run 35-40 miles a week and get to 50 miles the weeks before my marathon in April. I hope that will be enough for 3:30 (I think I will need a few marathons before I am ready for 2:59 next year). After I missed a fall marathon 2017 because of an achilles inflammation, I am very careful with my training. Consistency is key!

Have a nice day,

Martin

[Jon Allen]

Welcome, Martin. Your patient approach sounds like a good plan. Our general rule of thumb is to build up to 60 minutes a day, 5 days a week, plus a longer day, before adding speedwork. Consistency day after day and week after week, while being cautious for injuries, will yield the best results. Good luck!
Jon

[Martin]

Thank you, Jon!

It´s great how many fast runners are logged in here! Amazing your running accomplishments, you can be very proud!

In February, I planned exactly what you describe as general rule of thumb. What I´m not sure about is the length of my long runs, since I injured doing long marathonpace-runs (15, 20, 25k each 3 weeks apart) for my last marathon. I didn´t have enough mileage weekly to do that... Here I got some good advice from jtshad I am very thankful for! He suggested a linear buildup for my long runs (like 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20 miles or so). These days I read a lot about George Malley (malmo) who says:

What my point about the long runs is that they are way overrated, are disproportionately done with respect to the overall mileage and training goals, and should not be done at the expense of the other aspects of your training.

He even says that 25% of weekly mileage is too much...I think running long runs of 20 miles definitly have a mental value, but I´m not sure if just doing more mileage and spread it over a whole week would be a better option (to stay healthy). Another idea of mine is to just do 1 or 2 very easy 20 milers just to build confidence and feeling for the distance. Others long runs would be in the 10-13 miles range. Any suggestions?

Second question about your rule of thumb: where do you go from there? Skip rest day and doing a short easy run? Doubles or longer single runs? A combination of both?

Much appreciate any advice,
Martin

[Jon Allen]

Long runs can indeed be overrated, but only somewhat. If you're training for a marathon, I would not want to start the race without a number of 18-20 mile runs completed. But overall, I think too many people try marathons without enough base mileage. Doing a 20 miler when you only run 30-40 miles a week is problematic. If you run 60-70 per week, then it's easier. I do agree that if long runs impact your ability to run more than 2 days later, you may not have been ready for that distance yet.

Once you build up to 60 minutes, 5 days per week plus some longer run, you can start adding other stuff. I'm a fan of 2 runs per day, a few days a week. Or adding in a little speedwork (not too much, build up slowly). Or a combo. Whatever you think works best for you- you'll have adequate base to try them. It's hard to get over 60 miles per week with only single runs for many people. But whatever changes you make, go slowly to avoid injury.

Any other questions?

[Martin]

Jon,

to blame myself I read your answer only now. Sorry!

About long runs: I don´t think there is a magic number preparing for a marathon. It´s 20 miles in America and 35 km (~22 miles) in Europe. I like the idea to set time marks like 2 hours for regular long runs and 2,5 hours every other week to prepare for a marathon. I made the experience that everything longer than that made me very tired. But as you said, it could also be because of low mileage.

I´m a fan of doubles also. At the moment I´m at 5 x 60´ and 1 x 90´ per week. Over the summer, I decided to do a real base-building phase before adding any speed. You´re absolutly right about that! I will try to add 2-3 doubles, then I want to build my long run to 2 hours. Once I made it to about 8 hours of running per week, I should be close to 100 km (~60 miles) per week and ready to prepare with more tempo runs for a first marathon.