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Dave Holt
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« on: May 13, 2009, 10:45:03 am » |
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A question for anyone out there -
Our XC state championships here in Utah are on Oct. 21.
Of course we want to peak out for that (winning a state title is our main focus for our Varsity boys),
but we also have goals of qualifying for nationals. The Regional race isn't held until Nov. 21 and nationals on Dec. 5 - so the question is... How would you suggest I adjust training to get the kids to re-peak in late Nov?
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Jon Allen
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« Reply #1 on: May 13, 2009, 11:32:53 am » |
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I'm not a coach, but it seems to me that a 5k should be fairly easy to recover from. Maybe do a few easy days after state but then just repeat the last 4 pre-state weeks/workouts in the month before regionals. In other words, jump right back into peak training. They should be able to maintain peak racing speed for several months.
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Jeff Linger
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« Reply #2 on: May 13, 2009, 11:50:11 am » |
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Establish a 4 week Mesocycle that mimics your seasonal macrocycle. With each week of the new Mesocycle representing each of the 4 stages of your Macrocycle. Week 1 of the mesocycle would be equivalent to your base training phase, but this would be more oriented towards a recovery type week more so than base training. Week 2 would build up the volume and focus on strength (maybe hill work). Week 3 would begin the volume decrease and intensity increase (cruise intervals one day and maybe some mile repeats another) building through to your peak the following week (shorter interval work with solid recovery). I would look at 2 quality workouts a week to stay fresh and keep your 4th week light on the volume, but fast. If your team is good enough to handle doing well in states without needing to be at peak there, scale down the intensity slightly building into state so they've still got another gear to switch over to come regionals.
I should add that the 2 quality workouts should be somewhat intense, but not so much so that you're dogging your athletes. Remember, your trying to simply sharpen them, not looking to long term building. Make sure they're getting the recovery appropriate to the workout.
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« Last Edit: May 13, 2009, 12:10:20 pm by Jeff Linger »
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Jon Allen
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« Reply #3 on: May 13, 2009, 12:35:11 pm » |
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You can tell that Jeff has coaching experience and talks the talk, esp. compared to the rest of us. Mesocycle... volume... the guy knows what he is talking about.  |
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Jeff Linger
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« Reply #4 on: May 13, 2009, 01:01:04 pm » |
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LOL. I don't suspect I've got nearly the coaching experience that Dave has. I'm sure he was probably thinking the same things I expressed. He probably has some better ideas to take the general theory and put it into practice based on his athletes needs.
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Dave Holt
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« Reply #5 on: May 13, 2009, 01:15:23 pm » |
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Thanks for the compliment Jeff, but I doubt that it is true. But I was thinking right along those lines - two things just scare me: 1) I haven't ever had to prepare for this before 2) trying not to screw it up (I always worried about that with my very best athletes i.e. Ruthie - it is kind of like, just steer them in the right direction and let 'em go!
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Sasha Pachev
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« Reply #6 on: May 13, 2009, 01:45:37 pm » |
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Dave:
I am not peaking expert. I have never been fit enough to make peaking worth it. So I do not know how to peak. However, I do know how to run decent without having to peak, or in other words beat somebody else's peak with your average performance. The key is consistent base mileage. Do not hurt base training with speed work - use races for speed work instead. Train through all of the races. You run 10 seconds slower in the 2 miles, so what? Overtime you will start running faster and faster, and beating otherwise peak performances while untapered.
If you can manage to successfully teach your athletes about recovery, that would help a lot. In fact, I would say this. If they cannot learn the basics of recovery, the doctrine of peaking for them is useless. You carefully plan workouts to make something happen, then they blow it with one overnight party. Make sure they go to bed on time (good luck), make sure they eat healthy (good luck too). But if they could learn recovery, they would rock.
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Jeff Linger
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« Reply #7 on: May 13, 2009, 02:09:36 pm » |
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Sasha's got a great point there Dave. I essentially threw away any chance I had at being a serious runner by running as hard as I could for 4 years in my mid to late teens. No one taught me how and why to recover. At the end of it I had 2 knee surgeories and had lost all motivation to first race and eventually run. Teach them the importance of recovery, that its necessary step to get better (running easier on easy days results in running faster overall) and teach them what it feels like to run at a recovery pace.
Are you a USATF certified coach, Dave? If not, let me know, I'll search through the member archives and see if there's an article pertaining to this stuff.
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Jon Allen
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« Reply #8 on: May 13, 2009, 03:41:10 pm » |
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Thinking back on my HS days, I have to agree, Jeff. I would say the two biggest obstacles to our HS improving was running too hard on easy days (i.e. every day was a race) and not running enough miles (long run for us was 5-6 miles).
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Dave Holt
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« Reply #9 on: May 14, 2009, 08:40:38 am » |
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That is one of the hardest things about coaching high school athletes - they think that every race needs to be tapered for and hit with PR's and the such. Slowly (it took me all four years to finally start to break the mentality of some of the kids, and who knows if I'll ever teach some of them the right attitude - those that have "running" parents who think they know everything, and don't realize I know everything!) as a team we have been able to establish the idea that running is a culture, a lifetime activity - even... lifestyle. But at the same time, you want to hit big in the big races!
Jeff, unfortunately I missed the chance for certification when we held a class down here because of some family issues - maybe next year.
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Jeff Linger
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« Reply #10 on: May 14, 2009, 09:23:25 am » |
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I'll take a look at the USATF article archives and get back to you.
I was thinking about the recovery stuff some more too. I know that when I was in high school, if the coach said today is a recovery day, I still raced. I just didn't race at race pace. There were about 5 of us who were fairly decent, although I was a bit faster than the other 4. I looked at it like this: Its recovery day, fine, lets recover, but I'm the fastest, therefore my recovery pace should be quicker than their recovery pace. So they should be behind me. If they weren't then I must be going too slow. The next thing you know, we're 3 miles into a recovery run and hitting off 6:30s. I'm thinking the best thing the coach could have done on recovery day would have been to state at the onset of the run a leader for the day. Of course, with the use of GPS now its much easier for kids to maintain a set pace. We didn't even wear watches back in the 80s.
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breanna cobler
Lurker
Posts: 26
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« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2009, 10:02:59 am » |
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I generally do USATF XC after high school season, so my season gets stretched out. What I normally do is after state rest for a day or two if I want but then do about a week of regular running and then after that throw some speed workouts in to help me peak and then take the last few days to taper.
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